Thriving Alcohol-Free with Mocktail Mom

EP 108 The Problem of Normalized Drinking With Abby Calabrese

• Deb, Mocktail Mom • Season 1 • Episode 108

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What happens when you take alcohol out of the equation? According to this week’s guest, Abby Calabrese, you get deeper connections, a clearer mind, and a whole lot more fun! Abby is a mom of two, a passionate advocate and coach for alcohol-free living, and the host of The Alcohol-Free Coterie podcast. After years of navigating social drinking norms, Abby found freedom in sobriety and is now on a mission to help others do the same.

In this episode, we get into it all—how alcohol is pushed as a “normal” part of life, why the “drink responsibly” message falls flat, and how choosing an alcohol-free lifestyle opens the door to authentic friendships. Abby shares her journey to sobriety, the moment she knew she had to stop drinking, and how non-alcoholic beverages have made her transition easier (spoiler alert: she's a huge fan of NA wines and just won a case of her favorite!).

We also talk about the growing sober movement, the rise of alcohol-free bottle shops, and why mocktail culture is here to stay. If you’ve ever worried that quitting drinking means losing your social life—think again! Abby’s story is proof that the best connections happen when we show up as our true selves. So hit play and let’s raise a mocktail glass to making choices that truly serve us!


Get in touch with Abby!
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Join our membership community & let's make mocktails together!

You are loved. Big Time Cheers!

Deb:

Buckle up, friends, and welcome to the Thriving Alcohol-Free Podcast. I'm your host, deb, otherwise known as Mocktail Mom, a retired wine drinker that finally got sick and tired of spinning on life's broken record called Detox to Retox. Let this podcast be an encouragement to you. If alcohol is maybe a form of self-care for you where you find yourself dragging through the day waiting to pour another glass, I am excited to share with you the fun of discovering new things to drink when you aren't drinking and the joy of waking up each day without a hangover. It is an honor to serve as your sober, fun guide. So sit back and relax or keep doing whatever it is you're doing. This show is produced for you with love from the great state of Kentucky. Thanks so much for being here and big time cheers. Okay, hey, friends, it's Deb. Welcome back to Thriving Alcohol-Free. How are you? I'm so happy you're here and we have a very special guest today.

Deb:

I actually got to meet her IRL in person. What? Two weeks ago or a week and a half ago? Yeah, just a week and a half ago at Limestone Barbecue and Bourbon in Wilmington, delaware. I came out there for a mocktail workshop and Abby Calabrese came in person. She actually sat next to Kim, who's in my membership. I know you guys got to connect and stuff. So, abby, welcome to the podcast. Thank you so much. I'm so excited to be here. Oh, my gosh, I'm so happy to meet you. It was so great to just meet you in person and then to know that we were going to sit down. Actually, I have talks, so we didn't get to really chit-chat much. But you are living in the area where I grew up, which is so funny. You live on the main line. Well, I didn't live on the main line, but you live in the Philadelphia suburbs, which is where I grew up. So, yeah, birds, yes, okay, right, so this podcast will come out.

Deb:

I think it's going to come out right after the Super Bowl, oh my gosh. So, yes, you have your nails done, you are ready to go, you're ready to cheer them on. Where is the game? Is it in New Orleans? Is that where it is? Yeah, yeah, okay, yeah, because okay. So I was in Philadelphia or in Wilmington, Delaware, whatever the area right when you guys had the playoff championship. Who did we beat? Who did you beat? What team was that? I can't remember.

Abby:

Oh, my gosh oh.

Deb:

Commanders Okay, right, washington, right, washington, washington. So everybody was wearing green on my flight in and then on my flight out, everybody at the TSA was all dressed in green. I wanted to like so badly. I wanted to be great TikTok, wouldn't it? Yeah, all for the content. Okay, can I read your bio? Can I tell everybody who you are? Because you're such a special person, I want them to get to know you. Okay, abby Calabrese is an alcohol-free coach and podcaster, a brand new podcaster.

Deb:

You guys have to listen to her podcast. She's helping women embrace a fun love it fulfilling life in sobriety. That's fantastic. She blends practical tips, humor, life and sobriety that's fantastic. She blends practical tips, humor and a fresh perspective to make society approachable. I'm sorry, sobriety, not society In society. Well, you know some people, it's not so approachable. Right To make sobriety approachable and exciting. Abby is passionate about reducing the shame around alcohol struggles and inspiring women to discover a life they truly love. I love that. Thank you. Beautiful, beautiful, beautiful, okay. A life they truly love. I love that. Thank you. Beautiful, beautiful, beautiful, okay. I want to hear your story about how you broke up with alcohol. How did this happen? How did you become an alcohol-free coach and a podcaster. Where did this all start?

Abby:

If you told me, even two years ago, that this is what I'd be doing, I'd be like you've lost your mind and or what happened? Something must have happened right, because it just I was living the complete opposite maybe not complete opposite, but I was. Alcohol was a huge part of my life, you know, it was really. It's a pretty typical story and this is what's really drawn me to get more involved in this area, because I think my perception of someone who had a quote unquote problem with alcohol is completely different than what I experienced, and I'm sure a lot of people listening to this or out there probably don't even realize it or they really need to hear this to not feel like they're so alone and it's confusing.

Deb:

Yeah.

Abby:

But it was a typical high school party and drinking in college and it really just it made it so much easier to socialize and I had a lot of childhood trauma and it was just unhealed and it was a way for me to turn all that off right. It was, I had a lot of like pain and insecurity and doubt and alcohol. Just put that all on the back burner for a little bit and let me have a good time, and so that was really its place for a long time and it was kind of fine. You know, it was of course you had your nights that you went a little bit overboard, but it wasn't anything concerning. Where it really upticked was after I had my first son actually Really, really, yeah, and I've lived in New York City for 11 years after graduation and our first move to the suburbs was after we had our first son and he was little and I just noticed that, you know, once he got into a regular schedule, he would go to sleep at like 7, 7.30.

Abby:

But we were in what I called baby jail, because that's great, he's asleep, but you're there right, you're not going anywhere.

Deb:

You have him on the monitor, but you can't leave Right, right you can't leave the premise.

Abby:

So I was like, oh okay, and having lived in New York, we didn't really drink a lot in our apartment, because you're not in your apartment all that much. And so that's where I started to like, oh, I'll get some bottles of wine and bring them home and we'll have some cocktails. And that's really when the drinking at home began. And it's all a slow roll, right, it's not like, oh, all of a sudden it was a problem. It was really just slowly increasing. So I would start, one glass of wine quickly turned into two, turned to three. Pretty soon you're finishing a bottle and it's like whoa. And so that was pretty surprising.

Abby:

And then the next big thing that kind of jumped up the drinking charts was the pandemic which I hear that for so many women, same right, yep, and I think for me it was. You know, feeling that same loss of control, not knowing what to do, not knowing that unknowing. I have, you know, dealt with a lot of anxiety and that just kind of ratcheted that up Having a little kid during this time really hard. And so they deemed alcohol stores you know that they essential. So they kept those open, which I didn't Do. You know why they did that?

Deb:

Well, I mean, I think it was just marketing. I mean they just it makes so much money that I think is the lobbyist probably right, no Well.

Abby:

I think this is correct, but what I heard was because people get you know how they're addicted to alcohol if you just remove it, it's like life-threatening for people. You know, if you get to a certain level of alcoholism, you can't just take it away from somebody you know. So they deemed it essential, and so that's what I heard.

Deb:

But anyways, you didn't know that at the time, right, I think more and more of this is coming out.

Abby:

But I started going to like a Total Wine or those big stores and you could just pull right up, open the back of your car and they slide in. And it was cases, cases of wine and different things and I would, you know, stock up for the whole family, whatever everybody wanted. None of this crossed my mind as like problematic. It was like, oh well, we're stuck at home and you know it's a case of wine, nice wine. You know you're like I'm buying nice wine. This is not even boxed wine people yes, this has a pretty label on it Like how could this possibly be Right? And then I start noticing that those trips to refill start getting closer and closer to each other and I'm like, hmm, so that really started to ratchet it up.

Abby:

I did then have my second son and you know, during the pregnancy I never drank, but I was miserable, I was irritated, I was annoyed, I was like I didn't enjoy anything really without it. And you can talk yourself in or out of that. It's like, well, of course nobody likes being pregnant, or, oh, I bet you can't wait to have that glass of wine or what. This is all very normalized Like if you did this around another type of drug, people would be like, oh my God.

Deb:

Right, you're totally right.

Abby:

Right. But with alcohol it was like oh, I bet you can't wait, I bet you know all this stuff. So it was all just so normalized that again it was really no red flag to me, yeah. And then it, just after I had my son, there was always that period afterwards you're breastfeeding, doing all those things and I was still irritated because it was all like I can have a glass of wine, but then I have to wait so long and then I'm pumping and then I have to, and it was all just like this matrix in my mind the gymnastics, yeah yeah, gymnastics Right.

Abby:

And it was exhausting, and so then, once I was out of the breastfeeding stage, then it was back to drinking and again it just kept ratcheting up and I was feeling worse and worse and worse. I would wake up so irritable I felt sick, like literally sick my head, my stomach.

Abby:

It was getting harder and harder for me to eat, which was really weird like it just, yeah, it was just it was getting really, really bad and pretty much every time we would have like a night out, it ended in a blackout. No one, oh, I don't know about anybody, but I certainly didn't go into those evenings like I'm gonna black out.

Deb:

Oh no, no, you would probably went into it thinking I'm gonna have one, have one or one or two glasses of wine. This will be an elegant evening out.

Abby:

Right, right, and it never hit me the same way, like I could have the same amount of drinks one night and then the next night, and it would be totally different, and I would come up with every excuse oh, you know, I'm stressed, or I didn't drink enough water, I didn't eat enough, or what, and it's just like, okay, this is just getting crazy, but I really the end, there was no, there were a bunch of, you know, little rock bottoms, I guess, but there was no like huge event. It just got to the point where it was a combination of me being really scared for what direction I could see it going and just not wanting to feel sick anymore. I just wanted something better, and so I started listening to podcasts.

Deb:

Really, Was that your first tiptoe into sober curiosity?

Abby:

Yes, I would listen to some sober podcasts, but I would then like put them away. Starting on like Thursday, I'd be like that's enough.

Deb:

Let's go back to my business, the other podcasts I like to listen to. Yes, let's go back to my Bravo. I got to get my Bravo, okay, yeah.

Abby:

Right, and then on Monday, feeling terrible, start listening to the sober podcast again, and so it just and I so I always tell people that you know, whether they're following me on Instagram or listen to the podcast, like that's part of it, you know, I think you really do have to be like curious first, yep, and okay, what is this about? And start to dabble because it's almost too much to take in at once.

Deb:

I agree.

Abby:

Yeah, I agree. If you told me, oh, you know you're going to start this, then you're going to be sober the rest of your life, then you're going to be this warrior for sobriety, I'd be like, okay, hold on yeah, yeah, yeah.

Deb:

You're like I don't want to. I don't want to admit that. I'm sober, curious, let alone that I'm going to be an alcohol-free coach or coaching people. No, no, Never, never, no. Or I should say like the year before I became alcohol free. I would just like scroll. I would be drinking and I'd be scrolling on Instagram looking at these accounts and I'm thinking like, how does Tim well, not Tim McGraw but I was like how does he not drink? How does Tim McGraw not drink? Like I couldn't wrap my head around it Me neither, you know, I couldn't wrap my head around it, it seems so impossible.

Abby:

It felt like there'd be no joy, there'd be no excitement, there'd be no celebration, and it was so hard to admit for a long time what was going on, like even after I removed alcohol. It was just like, oh, this is just a hundred day challenge, or oh, you know whatever, or oh, I didn't really have an issue, or whatever. And then, more and more, as I get stronger and stronger in my sobriety, really being vulnerable and sharing how I truly felt, and all of that is just so cathartic. But also I know it's helping people and so that's getting easier and easier to do Totally.

Deb:

It's so freeing as I go into it is. It's so freeing, so did you feel a lot of shame, like about how you're drinking, like the slow roll? You called it like the slow roll, which I think many of us I know mine was the same way slow roll, that's a good description.

Abby:

Oh, my gosh Shame has followed me since childhood really, oh really. Yeah, yeah, really rough childhood.

Deb:

Very, very rough I'm sorry of.

Abby:

You know, when your home environment isn't stable and you can't rely on that for you know the unconditional love and safety and all of that, then everything's kind of rocked and you're kind of not trusting everything. And so how I and I didn't know this at the time, but how I adapted to that was trying to be the perfect little girl, and so I wanted to get the perfect grades and look perfect and act perfectly and, you know, do everything according, because maybe that that'll do it, that'll get that love, you know. And so that follows you. I mean, it followed me into college and, you know, academically I just really put a lot of pressure on myself. And then, like my career and what job I got into, it was never, never. What do I want to do? It was like, well, what is success? Like what is going to look good on paper, like impress people, make a lot of money. Nothing was like truly what Abby wanted to do, or like what brings me joy or fulfillment. It was all outward appearance to try to get that acceptance and love that I was so craving. Wow, that validation, yeah, yeah.

Abby:

And that drinking, you know, as soon as I discovered drinking, then too it was like, oh, this is even a faster track, right? Because it's like you know, once I started drinking, it felt like it softened the edges and it allowed me to be palatable to people. That's how I felt. I know now that that's not correct, right, that's all in your brain doing all of that. But I felt that that was the only reason people liked me was because I could hang quote, unquote, you know and always kind of like a guy's girl.

Abby:

I know a lot about sports and all of this stuff. And I could like hang, I could just, you know, go out all night and party and up for anything. And I was like, well, that's why people like me, so I can't stop that. Like I really had my identity tied to it. And then the idea that I would stop that would signify well, why would you stop that? Because you have a problem or an issue or something like that. And then I felt immense shame around that. It kept me stuck for a long time, like I think I would have quit drinking a lot earlier. But I was so terrified of the label alcoholic. I grew up with an alcoholic. I was like that, what?

Deb:

Like this is not.

Abby:

Yeah, it felt like am I just repeating exactly what I grew up and had so much difficulty with? And it kept me stuck. And I think through a lot of books, including like Quit, like a Woman, good books, good. Quitlet, yeah. Or the Snaked Mind you know it just gets you to start to realize Quitlet, yeah. Or this naked mind, you know it just gets you to start to realize, oh my gosh, like you don't have to have any label, you don't have to. It's just you're trying to choose a different path for yourself. You're curious, you're on this road of discovery and you realize you feel so much better.

Deb:

Bingo, right, right. So why it's so interesting? I was the same way, Like I probably would have stopped drinking, probably three years before I actually stopped, but I felt like if I don't drink, people are going to think I have a problem. Why is that? Like what is that? There's people listening right now who are thinking the same thing we were thinking. It's like just let that go, leave that on the side of the road and just walk forward into your sober curiosity.

Abby:

I know, I think society, I mean again, I always just compare it to something else, so I think it's easier to see the ridiculousness of it. But like, let's cocaine. Yeah, no one's like, wait, you can't moderate your cocaine, that's true. It's so true. You can't just do one or maybe two cocaine, I don't even know what.

Deb:

Yeah, what do they do? I don't even know what they do. Right here we are. Now we're going to start talking about things we have no idea. We really don't know.

Abby:

But do you know what I?

Deb:

mean that I've never tried, never tried anything, yeah.

Abby:

That's downright ridiculous.

Deb:

Yeah, or like cigarettes. Yeah, oh, you can't just have one moderate?

Abby:

Yeah Well, that's how they push it too, like on all the alcohol commercials drink responsibly, and then they wipe their hands of it.

Deb:

Oh isn't that true?

Abby:

There's DUIs and all of these diseases and cancers and everything that this causes and violence, and people are dying from it and they're like well, just do it responsibly.

Deb:

Imagine that with any other addictive substance violence and people are dying from it and they're like, well, just do it responsibly. Imagine that with any other addictive substance yeah, no, you're totally right. Or an ad for cocaine. And then just like, okay, snort responsibly. Is that what they do, just responsibly?

Abby:

Yeah, and someone was saying I haven't been to Disney World since I was a kid but they were saying they have like carts handing out alcohol at Disney World. It's like imagine them doing that with drugs. It's like you would be like what is going on? And so I think it's just society. We're not there yet. But look at tobacco products and cigarettes and everything. No one judges you for not smoking, but there was a time where it was like well, why don't you just smoke? Oh, I want to lose weight. Well, smoke. You want a smaller baby? I read that somewhere. They used to say doctors used to say you want a smaller baby, smoke cigarettes.

Deb:

I should have done. Hannah was nine pounds, one ounce people Apparently. I was not smoking when I was pregnant.

Abby:

I had like an almost 10-pound baby. No, you didn't. I was like yes.

Deb:

And you're tiny.

Abby:

You are tiny, I know it was not good, it was not good, it's like a tenth of your weight, oh my God. And he's still huge, is he? He has this huge head.

Deb:

Yeah, Now how old are your kids? Sorry, I didn't even ask you how old are your children.

Abby:

They're six and three. Okay, oh you little ones.

Deb:

Oh my gosh, what a fun time of life, amazing Abby, and here you are, living an alcohol-free lifestyle and you to enjoy being their mom and be present with them. Be present with them in a way that, like you, wouldn't be otherwise. No.

Abby:

And I was. I really wasn't, and I noticed it with my older son and so I've been sober. Now it's a little over a year. My sober date's 11-11-23. The one time so like he doesn't even understand still what alcohol is or anything like that, of course, but they can tell when you're being a little bit different. And one of the last times, like I said, I had a lot of little rock bottoms but I walked him home from like a neighborhood party it was a Halloween party right at the end of my drinking and that walk home was fuzzy at best, yeah, and I was like I won't do it again. I grew up in this and all I said growing up is I will not do this to my family. And it happens in a way. It's so tricky, it's like sneaky. It doesn't happen in the exact way that you experience. It finds another way to creep in.

Deb:

You're right, it doesn't come and knock on the front door. That was another thing where I was like, no, yeah, boy, halloween's a drinking day, isn't it? It's become like a drinking holiday for moms. Yeah, huge. Yeah, I used to put wine in my Yeti or whatever and lock my dollars around. So have you made a lot of new friends and surprised you haven't been sober that long I mean a year and a couple months, I know. Congratulations.

Abby:

Thank you. Amazing, I know, I know, and especially at this age, I feel like I just went through a lot of different phases. So you go from the college to the post-college, to early you know, motherhood you know, and along each of those phases you see friends kind of coming and going, because as you're in those different phases, it becomes hard to relate to people that aren't in your phase Not that you're not going to be friends with them, right right, but it's like they don't have kids.

Deb:

They don't understand. I'm staying up all night. They don't understand. I'm sick of kids. They don't understand your infections, yeah yeah, it's not that you don't love them as a friend, you're just in different stages.

Abby:

Yeah, you part of you know I was terrified if I quit drinking, all my friends are going to be like lame, all right, see you later. You know what I mean and I hear that from a lot of people that I coach and talk to. But what's so cool is you're sober friends, which I know kind of sounds a little cheesy, but once you're in it it is like a fast track to getting to like the real stuff. You know what I mean. Like you've all been through it and so you just have this knowing between you and you can just like cut out all the small talk and you just get right down to it and there's something so cool about that. And so I just feel like the connections that I've made through sobriety have been honestly some of the best ever.

Deb:

That's amazing. I mean now the sober community. I think, like no matter what age somebody is, that you have this thing in common and it just it strips away a lot of that fakeness, that you don't need alcohol to be able to to chit chat and, to quote unquote, connect right, like right. Didn't we all connect so much at parties or whatever you know connecting when we were drinking? No, I wasn't connected with anybody, I was zoning out, you know buzzing out. But now we can really connect with people instantly.

Abby:

Yeah, and I kind of get a rush Like it's like similar to that feeling that I used to like crave from the alcohol or whatever. I get that rush because it's like I don't know. It's just that connection and feeling really understood and having similarities. It's just a really, really good feeling and I felt it at your event.

Deb:

Oh, I'm so glad I know you got to say hi to Kim. She's just the sweetest. So great, she's the sweetest. I'm so glad you guys ended up sitting next to each other. That was like it was just all so random how it all happened. So I'm so glad you guys got to connect. She's wonderful. So I don't know, kim, if you're listening, we love you. If you're listening, we do. Yes, she's awesome. Okay, yeah, so we had a mocktail event, the mocktail workshop. So what do you think of all the boom of all these non-alcoholic auctions, the sober movement? I mean it's incredible, right?

Abby:

It's amazing, yeah. So I, the weekend before I went to another sober event in Philly that had a lot of vendors set up Good and it's just so amazing to see because, I think, one it signals to you a lot. You just have to see out in real life IRL, as you say because it's like okay, great, I'm going to do this, but am I going to be this odd duck everywhere I go, where I'm like oh, can I have a mocktail? What do you mean? A mocktail Like that is really discouraging. So to see all of these brands coming up and seeing more and more restaurants having these options, you just naturally even if it's not consciously, subconsciously you're like oh, this is like a thing, this is happening and I'm not alone, and there are all these other people that clearly, you know, want this and want this for themselves. So I think that there's something so validating about it. But then there's just like it helps me.

Deb:

It's not just for show it literally helps me.

Abby:

Like last night I just made a quick little, like you know, alcohol-free margarita and it just felt so good and, like you know, you garnish it and it feels special and it's symbolic and it really has helped me so much in my sobriety to have those options and still feel like I can have a special little drink and it tastes great and all the options you had are so great. I'm making those for the Super Bowl.

Deb:

Oh, good, good, no, it is. It's like the first time I went out to order something to drink, the first time I went out and I ordered a mocktail, the girl was like why can't you make you a Shirley Temple? I mean, it was back in 2021. So it was like wah-wah. So it has changed so much in just the last couple of years. It's incredible, but right just to continue to have that ritual. Just change the ingredients and now you're not making a hangover, you're not even if you crave two more or whatever. So you know what I mean. So you have two more or whatever, but like it's not, there's no shame attached to it the next day. Yeah, it's just. Yeah. Alcohol free options have have helped me so much in my alcohol free journey. It's helped so much yeah.

Abby:

So much Cause I really my personality. A lot of people are like oh well, why don't you just like? Or especially now, now you've gone so long, why don't you just have one or two? And it's like that's just not how my body works and it's there's no shame in that. That's just like understanding how you work, like if I was my, I didn't process dairy very well, or whatever you would avoid it right.

Abby:

Because you'd be like no, I'm not going to, like you know what I mean. So you get to know how your body interacts, and not everybody's like that. I'm not someone that thinks like everybody needs to do what I'm doing, but I think you really have to take. Then, all of a sudden, boom, it would hit me and so it's like, okay, well, that's how my body breaks down and processes alcohol, and that's not great. And so now I can have these other options and not worry at all.

Deb:

Yeah, and there's delicious things to drink? Yeah, and you have that shop near you. I swung by there. I pulled in. Somebody DM me on Instagram after the mocktail workshop we did in Wilmington. Somebody DM'd me and I don't know her, she doesn't even have a profile picture, but she was like oh, if you're in the area you should go to. What is it? Wallace Dry Goods? Yes, right On the main line, and I was like closed, so I called to make sure they were going to be open, drove out there it is the most beautiful bottle shop. I mean, it is incredible.

Deb:

Incredible it feels so elegant, elevated and just the way she has everything laid out. It's beautiful. So yeah, you live near a gem, I mean.

Abby:

I know and she's so lovely and she has like these awesome events. I went to a little flower arranging event there.

Deb:

Okay yeah.

Abby:

And it's just nice. And then she introduces new products. You get to taste them before you kind of decide on what you want. But that's where I found a lot of options. Yeah, it just feels really good in there, like think about like a traditional liquor store. It's so like grimy.

Deb:

Yeah, you're right. No, you're right, no this was like you felt, like you were like walking into, like you know, a pottery barn, almost.

Abby:

Yes, but there's all these beautiful bottles in the shelf.

Deb:

She has beautiful glassware. Yeah, I'm going to have her on the podcast for sure. I just love I love her shop. Yeah, that's the secret.

Abby:

Yes, and her whole message is so great. Like you saw the sign in the back, it's all about cheers to choices, Right and yep, Like someday is it going to be.

Deb:

you know you always see regular and decaf coffee Is it going to always see regular wine and it's going to be yeah, it's going to be leaded and unleaded. Yep, yep, regular and non-alcoholic, absolutely, definitely going that way. Yeah, cheers to choices. I love her. Her little tagline Beautiful, okay. So if you are at home, you'll make a margarita for yourself. Do you drink any of the non-alcoholic wines? Do you like any?

Abby:

of those. Yes, yes, okay, do you have?

Deb:

any favorites that you want to tell everybody about that they should be drinking Sauvignon Blanc. I love Gießen. Oh, you're speaking my love language. They're my favorite. Yes, I just won a giveaway, so they I didn't even realize it.

Abby:

Yes, so did you want a whole case of it then? Probably because that's what they do. I just did some giveaways with them and yeah, and so I've been getting pictures of people who got the box of a case.

Deb:

Oh my gosh, I was so excited. Oh yeah, that's like Christmas for you.

Abby:

Yeah, I know my husband's like what just happened. I'm like I just want a case of non-alcoholic wine.

Abby:

This is like it's a lot of wine. I'm so excited. I was like this is awesome, yeah, so that's one of my favorites. And my favorite red is St Viviana, oh yeah, okay, their Cabernet is really good, because red has been tricky to find, yep, yep, but that one, I think, is really really good. And then if you add a little bitters or actually Kim was saying she adds a little balsamic to some, depending on how it, you know, is kind of feeling so that's my favorite. And then I think the sparkling in general are just way better, do you?

Deb:

Okay yeah, okay yeah. There's so many good options. Yeah, yeah.

Abby:

Prima Pave.

Deb:

Which one? Prima Pave? Oh, it's delicious. Yes, really nice, really Really nice, really nice. Yeah, okay, you have nice, nice wine options. Yes, so many good things to drink. We're not drinking. And if you go out, okay. Last question If you go out and order something in a restaurant, they don't have like a mocktail on the menu is there something you typically ask for for them to make for you, or what do you normally get?

Abby:

Yeah, I have like Heineken Zero, and maybe you don't want that, you know. So if it's a bare bones place, I always just do club soda with a splash of some sort of juice.

Deb:

Okay, and then a bunch of limes, perfect, easy.

Abby:

Yeah.

Deb:

And then you feel like you're having something that looks, you know, maybe a little more elevated than Diet Coke or I see, and certainly have that if you want to. But sometimes there's a situation where you feel like I kind of want to have something a little special or look a little more like it's the same thing as everybody else is drinking.

Abby:

So yeah, and you can always tell them what type of glass you want it into.

Deb:

That's good. That's a good tip.

Abby:

Yeah, Because sometimes they'll make it like they're making like a kid drink or something. I'm like, oh no, can you actually grab me a different glass? And they're happy to like. I really have never gotten any pushback. People are really really nice about their hospitality.

Deb:

They want to serve. They want you to be happy.

Abby:

Yes, yes, they're hoping you're happy.

Deb:

Okay, any last advice you would give to somebody maybe who's sober curious, who's listening, who is maybe curious about alcohol-free living it's all about small steps.

Abby:

So I think what kept me stuck or what you know know it was just this the idea of forever or all right, my whole life's going to change, my friends are going to change. It's too overwhelming, it's just don't even think about that yet, and all of it has a way of falling into place. Right now I would say stay curious, keep listening to podcasts, listen to other women's stories and just try small, bite-sized pieces and if you're ready to do a little bit more, do the 100 days. I think dry January is a great start to the 100 days, but you need to give it more time to really see what it's like to have it out of your system, and it takes a long time to work its way out of your system and allow your brain to start re-regulating your dopamine levels and all of this great stuff that happens. Give it some time and just say you're doing a challenge. It doesn't have to be anything more than that, but just take these small steps.

Deb:

I love that. I love that Right. And just tell people you're doing a challenge and like, let it go. I love that, right. And just tell people you're doing a challenge and like, let it go, totally Right. Like, whatever questions they have, they don't need to, it doesn't, it doesn't involve them, they don't need to know, right, yeah, yeah, that's great advice. That's such great advice and right, 100 days, boy you really feel. And that gives you an opportunity to experience different events. So maybe it's a birthday or it's an anniversary or it's, you know, a barbecue, but there's different things that you go through, maybe that you're not experiencing during, like, a dry January or something.

Abby:

Totally, and it's okay if those feel awkward, because every other time you've been walking in and your brain knows oh, I'm about to receive some alcohol, yeah Right.

Abby:

And so when you stop doing that, your brain's like what's happening? Like where is that? So you have to give your brain some time to be like wait, we carved it, we're carving a new path here and then it'll. It'll get it and it won't feel so awkward over time. But you have to give yourself those opportunities. A lot of people will do dry January but just stay home for a month and I'm like but you didn't do any of the things, right?

Deb:

So you're not giving yourself time. Yeah, when you try to go on the shore this summer, it's going to be a little different than when you stayed home and it was snowing and it feels very different. Yeah, no, that's right. And building those new highways in our mind. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly okay, make sure everybody can follow you on instagram. Uh, your instagram is alcohol free abby a b b y. Your podcast is the alcohol free coterie. Oh, kind of the worst coterie. Okay, sorry, i'm'm the worst Coterie. Okay, sorry, I'm so uneducated. I'm so sorry. My audience knows, they know I can't read a bio. I apparently screwed that up as we were starting this podcast.

Abby:

Oh good.

Deb:

Your website is abbycalabresecom. It's C-A-L-A-E-R-E-S-Ecom and Abby's A maybe why. I'll put that in the show notes or anything on that as well.

Abby:

Yeah.

Deb:

They can find you, but make sure you're following Abby on Instagram. She's adorable and just a wealth of information. So thank you, thank you, congratulations to you on your sober journey and on just inspiring other women, inspiring others to do the same, so thank you for being my guest today.

Deb:

Yes, thank you. Thank you, it was so fun Big time. Cheers to you for tuning in to the Thriving Alcohol-Free Podcast. I hope you will take something from today's episode and make one small change that will help you to thrive and have fun in life without alcohol. If you enjoyed this episode and you'd like to help support the podcast, please share it with others, post about it on social, send up a flare or leave a rating and a review. I am cheering for you as you discover the world of non-alcoholic drinks and as you journey towards authentic freedom. See you in the next episode.