Thriving Alcohol-Free with Mocktail Mom

EP 131 | Garnish with Friends & Meet Spirited Zero Proof Brand, Dromme

• Season 2 • Episode 131

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In this episode, Deb Podlogar interviews David Lund, the founder of Dromme, a non-alcoholic drink brand. They discuss David's journey from finance to creating Dromme, the unique ingredients used in the drinks, and the benefits they offer. David shares insights on the challenges of starting a business in the non-alcoholic space, the importance of community support, and the meaning behind the brand's name. The conversation highlights the growing interest in non-alcoholic options and the positive impact of Dromme on consumers' lives.


The podcast promotes enjoying drinks with friends, not just alcohol.

David Lund transitioned from finance to create Dromme.
Dromme offers complex flavors without alcohol.
The brand focuses on fresh, high-quality ingredients.
Droma's ingredients include herbs like ashwagandha and lion's mane.
Regular consumption of Dromme can lead to long-term benefits.
Dromme means 'dream' in Danish, reflecting its cultural roots.
The non-alcoholic space is growing with community support.
Challenges in production can lead to innovation.
David emphasizes the importance of moving forward despite setbacks.


Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Dromme and David Lund
05:34 The Journey of Creating Dromme
16:02 Understanding the Ingredients and Their Effects
20:34 The Meaning Behind Dromme and Its Philosophy
22:51 Creating a Community Around Non-Alcoholic Drinks
29:36 The Journey of Building a Brand
33:43 Challenges in Production and Overcoming Obstacles
40:51 The Importance of Perseverance in Business

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You are loved. Big Time Cheers!

SPEAKER_03:

Welcome up friends, and welcome to the Thriving Alcohol Free Podcast. I'm your host, Deb, otherwise known as Mocktail Mom, a retired wine drinker that finally got sick and tired of spinning on life's broken record called Detox to Retox. Let this podcast be an encouragement to you if alcohol is maybe a form of self-care for you, or you find yourself dragging through the day waiting to pour another glass. I am excited to share with you the fun of discovering new things to drink when you aren't drinking and the joy of waking up each day without a hangover. It is an honor to serve as your sober fun guide. So sit back and relax or keep doing whatever it is you're doing. This show is produced for you with love from the great state of Kentucky. Thanks so much for being here and big time cheers. Okay, hey friends, it's Deb. Welcome back to Thriving Alcohol Free with Mogtow Mom. I am so happy you're here today. We have a very special guest. I'm so happy, you guys. I have been wanting to speak with David Lund of Droma for the longest time. Uh actually, a friend, a mutual friend, introduced introduced us, connected us to um Kate. Uh Kate Dinay introduced us uh via email. And so I'm so happy you're here today. David is the founder of Droma. It's been what three years you guys have been in business.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, yeah, it has. Thanks for having me. This is um this is great. I love I love doing these and kind of talking about the story and talking about the business and the ups and downs and all the craziness and and the fun times too. So I'm glad that uh glad I'm able to be on here.

SPEAKER_03:

I can't wait to hear the ups and the downs. First, though, we're gonna make a Nana Ball cocktail. We're gonna make a calm old fashioned using the delicious droma com. Okay. This is so good. I don't need to tell you because you created it, but I'll just tell you I'm a huge fan.

SPEAKER_00:

It is it is good. Yeah. It's it's kind of fun now that we're coming into some colder months too, because I feel like it's uh it's a great fall winter drink because it has, you know, the maple and the and the ginger to kind of warm you up a little bit. And so I actually use it, uh, I've started using, I mean, I I use it at nighttime. So I'll I'll take you know some herbal tea um and mix it like on a it was at in a hot drink, which is really well is is good too. So, but it because the ginger, like if you mix it with um just something basic, like okay, some chamomile teas, a little honey, and and um a shot of droma calm, and you've got yourself like a little hot toddy or a nice warming drink, too. So um old fashions are obviously my favorite with the with the product, so I'm excited to have you make one of those. But um, but yeah, it's it's really versatile and kind of how you can use it, I would say.

SPEAKER_03:

That's awesome. Actually, I have a membership, and last night we had a happy half hour um with some of the ladies, and they were they were saying we need hot drinks, like we need to talk about hot drinks. So that's perfect. So for for the ladies in the membership, the Mocktail Social Club, that that drink is for you. So grab some grab some calm. Okay, I have um I have just my uh Rux glass here, and I've got a my big ice cube, which is so fun. I never made big ice cubes before before I started.

SPEAKER_00:

They're the best. The big ice cubes are the best. Yeah. Aren't they?

SPEAKER_03:

They're so fun. So fun. Okay, so uh I have measured out, I already have my um, I did one ounce. I'm using um Free Spirits bourbon. So what should I put in first? What do you you I'll let you walk me through making it? How's that?

SPEAKER_00:

Um yeah, so you got your ice. I like to um I like to put the bourbon in or the alcohol spirit alternative in first, so you can kind of pour that in.

SPEAKER_01:

Perfect.

SPEAKER_00:

That'd be great. And then the droma. Yep. Is that your droma? Yep. This is, yep, yep, I've got it measured out.

SPEAKER_03:

Yep. Okay.

SPEAKER_00:

And then maybe yeah, a little like just a touch.

SPEAKER_03:

Okay.

SPEAKER_00:

Just a touch of simple syrup.

SPEAKER_03:

Perfect.

SPEAKER_00:

And then your bitters, perfect. Okay.

SPEAKER_03:

Okay, I've got myself some aromatic bitters. So, or you could use what, uh, the Angostera bitters? Is that what would be like?

SPEAKER_00:

Yep, those are good too. Okay, I like both of those.

SPEAKER_03:

If somebody doesn't have all the bitter, so we can do that. A couple of dashes. I don't even know what a dash was, David. Did you were you a cocktail drinker before you started droma? Like, I was that cocktail drinker.

SPEAKER_00:

Not not really. Yeah, I didn't drink very much alcohol. I mean, that's kind of the the idea behind droma and and why I started it. But um I mean, obviously I've I've had an alcoholic beverage before, but um, yeah, it's uh yeah, the dash is kind of funny, huh? Like the dash and the um all these, like all the lingo that you have. All the terms, right?

SPEAKER_03:

I mean when it's when I first ordered all the bitter and it came to me the very first time, and I, you know, read the recipe dash, I took, I was like this, like a little tiny baby drop. I was like, okay, that's a dash. I was like, well, do much to the drink. Didn't add much to it.

SPEAKER_00:

I feel like everybody has their own view of a dash sometimes to depending on how like how strong you want the drink, especially when you're working with bitters. You know, some people like it a little bit more bitter than others, and so I think uh the dash gives you some flexibility and in how much you actually put it in.

SPEAKER_03:

What is a dash?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, that's okay.

SPEAKER_03:

I'm gonna give it a little stir. Get your stir perfect. And I have a little like let's start a cherry from Trader Joe's. I'm gonna go ahead and put it on there. Okay. Big time cheers to you, David. Yes, you got your you got your bottle there?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, hold on. Let me make like I have my bottle, so I was gonna actually pour a little bit in too.

SPEAKER_01:

Great, great.

SPEAKER_00:

I don't have all the ingredients for the old fashioned, but sometimes with calm, I actually just like to drink like just a shot of it too. Um which is kind of nice because it's like it's so like it's so flavorful, right? And it's like it has so much power that a little bit goes a long way too. And so I'll do that like both with calm and awake, like every once in a while I'll just like pour myself just like a little shot, just have like in a glass and can either sip on it or just like take it. But yeah, cheers.

SPEAKER_03:

Cheers, cheers. Thank you for being here. Uh-huh. That is so delicious. Okay, we want to know the magic. How did you come up with this? So three years ago you started COVID, you told me you were started thinking about this. Uh-huh. How did you come up with this? How did you come up with the ingredients? And what's it been like what's it been like?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, for sure. So, yeah, so I think uh so for me, I came from um I was working in finance before this. Uh, I worked for like an investment company. And so um, but I was ready for a change. I was I was ready to kind of start my own thing. I've been thinking about different ideas and and you know, different areas I want to focus on. But you know, what's interesting with the non-alcoholic space, I feel like 10 years ago, 10, 15 years ago, there wasn't very many options at all, right? Like for sure. So being in finance and and being in business and and going to, you know, dinners and cocktail functions and all these things, and really just being stuck with my diet coke in hand and my lime. You know, if I wanted to get really crazy, like a little bit of lime on top.

SPEAKER_03:

Add a little lime. Yeah. Now they now they make it in the you can buy it in the can, just like that.

SPEAKER_00:

I know. You get it all in one now, which is confusing.

SPEAKER_03:

You were a trendsetter, David, back in the day. You didn't know.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. And so I'd either have my Diet Coke or my soda water. Um, and so, but I didn't think too much about it. I felt like I was usually the only one, um, you know, like not drinking. And so I never really thought of it as like a business, you know, opportunity. And so, anyways, I think what was interesting was COVID. Um, I guess a little bit, you know, prior to COVID, there were some brands that kind of launched, and I think it got a little more popular, but you always had like seed lip in the bars and and liars. I think, you know, it'd been around for a little bit longer, too. But what was interesting was I think in COVID, people just started like drinking way too much, right? I think the pendulum swung like way, way too far. You're at home, you've got so much time on your hands. Like, what else are you gonna do besides make yourself a you know, a handful of cocktails? And so, and then maybe that swung a little bit too far, right? And people were like, Whoa, I am actually not feeling that great. I'd rather get outside. I'm tired of being inside, like I'd rather go hike. I I mean, I saw this, I was in California during during COVID.

SPEAKER_01:

Okay.

SPEAKER_00:

And um in San I was living in Santa Barbara, California, and um, which was you know, a little bit less restrictive, I would say in general, versus you know, some parts of the of the state. But you know, people started like after the first few weeks, it was like, all right, we're getting out, let's go hike, let's, you know, get outside. And so I think, and obviously we've seen kind of like a health and wellness trend that's evolved over the last decade. And um, and I think alcohol was something that maybe started to get, you know, on people's radars where it's like, oh, maybe I can cut back a little bit. And then with um a couple of new brands launching and and some different, I would say, approaches to the space where it was like, you know, I kind of felt like it was this hard, like you're either sober or not sober. Um if you're sober, you know, we've got a not like a very sugary cocktail for you, and that's kind of the only option. Or, like I said, you know, you sip on a Diet Coke or something. And so, um, but I think people started to like want to feel like they were drinking something a little bit more complex, a little more interesting. And so maybe that was like a spark to the space. And so for me, I started to like buy up all these brands. I was like, this is awesome. I can be a cocktail drinker and like make my own cocktails at home and doesn't have to have alcohol in it. And so I loved that like there were all these new brands coming out, as and and so it got me excited. And then at the same time, I was um, I was, you know, like I said, I was ready to kind of make a change and try to try something new. So for me, I just started like messing around with ingredients in my kitchen, um different flavors and different ideas. I had a friend um in LA that was a bartender, and he actually went sober. Um so he was, you know, he was a bartender and sober, and he's like, hey, like I'd love to work with you and kind of help you on some ideas and recipes, um flavors, all those kind of things. So he was actually a really big support um in the early days too, to kind of give me some idea and direction. Like I said, because I wasn't a big cocktail drinker and I, you know, I'm not a bartender, and so I needed the help from someone in the space. And so yeah, after like just tons of iterations, right? Like you're just messing around with flavors and ideas. And and so for me with droma, I always wanted it to be a little bit different. Um, I wanted to create something that had um some more depth to it, both just from a taste perspective, but also from um an herbal and botanical perspective. And so I'm um I'm a big believer in herbs and kind of the way that they can help you um and support, you know, different lifestyles. And so I've used Ashwagonda and Lion's mane and some of these things through, you know, a lot of my life. And I felt uh like I felt some effect and I felt like they've they've been beneficial for me. And so, you know, I was like, well, why don't why not make a drink that has, you know, the interesting taste and complexity of a cocktail, but also has some other benefits instead of just you know, flavored water or sugar and water or something like that. And so that was really like the premise of why I wanted to create it, where it's like, okay, this is something that I would drink on a regular basis. I can make myself a cocktail pretty easily. Like, I don't need too much, like because wasn't difficult.

SPEAKER_03:

Even this, this wasn't difficult. It's delicious, it's so good.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, it's not too difficult to make. You have like you can you can you can make really complex cocktails with with um or like really like I would say interesting cocktails with different components that you use and flavors that you add, like whether you're using like fresh juices or your own herbs and extracts and things like that, like yeah, you can make the some like very advanced um type of cocktails, but in reality, droma can be just used on its own. Like I said, like sometimes I'll just take a shot and sip on it. Um, or it can be mixed with soda water, it can be mixed with, you know, LaCroix or any other like sparkling things you have. Um, you can add some fresh mint, some you know, basil and things like that. So I wanted it, I wanted it to be simple but complex, right? From that standpoint, where it can be used in lots of different ways. Some people even mix it with alcohol. I've got a guy that buys it on a weekly basis and he mixes it with his whiskey, and he's like, hey, I've cut back, you know, I've I've reduced my whiskey intake by half. Wow. And now I just mix droma with my whiskey, and he's like, I feel better because I'm drinking less. That's and you know, I've got a better tasting drink too. So so there's a lot of ways that you can use it. Um, and that's kind of what like the idea was behind it. And when it comes to like the ingredients, that's like that's really important. I mean, that's where we spend a lot of our time is finding the right ingredients, finding the right sources for these ingredients, um, finding like the best that we can that we can find and and eat, you know, for each ingredient. And then the hard thing was like mixing some of the flavor, like we wanted a certain flavor and taste and mouthfeel, and then also adding the herbs and botanicals. And so I think those that can be kind of a challenge sometimes when you're when you're dealing with something like ashwagon or lion's mane that does not taste very good.

SPEAKER_03:

Okay, and so you gotta you would never know it's in here. You would never know.

SPEAKER_00:

So that was a big challenge. Like, there was a lot of iterations going back and forth and like the type of ashwagon we were gonna put in, the amount of like, and some of these things where it's like, yeah, it really starts to affect the taste. Um, but I think we found like a really good balance where it's like it's not too, it doesn't taste like uh it doesn't taste like a supplement. You know, it tastes really flavorful. Um, it has the supplements in it. Um, and then you know, we use organic stuff wherever we can. Um it's not 100% organic, but we try our best to. So like the major ingredients in DromaCon, which we're drinking right now, is organic Vermont um maple syrup. So that's that's a big part of the pro of the bottle. Um we also put in organic ginger root, which is not a ginger flavor. And so like that's where you get like the ginger burn and um the real fight, the real feel of that ginger. And so ingredients and like the way that like we make the drink is is super important to us. And so that was kind of the um, you know, how we started. And then um, yeah, I think production, like the other thing for us that was important was all right, like there's lots of different brands out there, there's lots of different ways people make the product. Um, I would say like obviously the most common way is you get a, you know, you partner with a co-packer and you, you know, you do a big production run and you sell those, you know, sell those bottles over the year. Like with botanicals and herbs, like I've always kind of been a believer of like the fresher the better. And so our process is really unique. We produce once, sometimes twice a week. Um, and so our product, like when you're buying a bottle of droma, like there's a good chance that was produced like within a week or two ago.

SPEAKER_01:

Wow.

SPEAKER_00:

And so that I think is really unique for our brand too, where it's like we're getting like the product, like our our goal was like from production to consumption as as short as possible, right? Because we want it to feel like you're drinking something different. Like it's not like um anything else on the market. It's very unique, it's flavorful, it's fresh, it's it's um, it's got that bite. Um and so production, ingredients, um, and development is kind of where we spend a lot of our time and energy. And we want to obviously put out the best product possible. And so those are the kind of things that we that we wanted to do with droma and make it a really unique experience for people, right? Like so if you go into a bar and you order a drink a drink with droma in it, you know, like you're getting something that like tastes and feels like you're you're you're drinking a pretty complex and interesting cocktail instead of something, you know, bland or too sugary.

SPEAKER_03:

So what can somebody expect to feel um if they're drinking the calm? Like somebody who's maybe not aware of like functional ingredients, um, ashwagonda, lion's mane, how's that gonna make them feel?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, um, so I would say most of our most of our botanicals and herbs are um longer lasting, like longer. So like, for instance, like ashwagon, lion's mane, um, some of these other adaptations that we have in the product, it's not necessarily you're gonna feel something right when you drink it. Okay, but like for me, like as my bot, like as your body takes in herbs and botanicals and supplements, like your your body starts to adjust adjust and feel those things over time, right? So I think the best way that you're gonna feel something from drama um is if you drink it on a regular basis. And then you start to, and and some of those things will like will be in your system, right? Yeah, I mean it's it's not like alcohol you're gonna feel like right away, but it's more of like this this longer lasting effect and better for you, obviously. Yeah. Um uh calm has valerian root in it.

SPEAKER_01:

Okay.

SPEAKER_00:

So valerian root is a pretty powerful herb. Um that is something that I think people feel a little bit. So, and it helps you relax. And so we put, you know, a pretty decent amount of valerian root in this. So, like people use this as a nightcap. And so um, so I would say, you know, you drink two shots of droma, calm. You know, you'll feel a little relaxed. Um you're not gonna be sleepy.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah, you're not gonna feel groggy. Yeah, I've never felt groggy drinking.

SPEAKER_00:

No, no, but I think people drink this all the time to help them sleep better. So they almost use it as an herbal remedy sometimes where it's like, hey, I gotta have my shot or two of droma and I'll sleep better. So I would say the valerian root helps with that, and you'll feel something from that. Um uh this also has 5 HTP in it, so that's a nootropic that's kind of uh it helps it helps with mood and it helps like decrease anxiety and stuff like that. So I would say you feel a little bit of that also a little bit quicker than you would feel the Ashwagon Lion's mane. Um, but yeah, so the Valerian root, 5 HTP kind of help with like more of the immediate feelings, and then the Ashwagonda, lion's mane um help with longer term. I guess it also has lemon balm. So lemon balm also has like that calming effect, right? That I would say you can feel a little bit more immediately. Um so depending on how much you drink, uh like that will also affect kind of how like your feelings. So if you just have like a shot, a shot of it, like one or one and a half ounces, you're probably not gonna feel too much. You have about two ounces, two and a half ounces, you might feel a little bit more.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Um so and then the other product, awake, has more rejuvenating ingredients in it. So um awake is my favorite like daytime drink. So I make uh I I'm constantly I drink more awake than I do calm, to be honest. Because I love it after lunch, like in the afternoon. I'll make myself an awake cocktail. So that's got pomegranate molasses, it's got verjus, it's got Sichuan pepper, cayenne pepper. So that one's got power um on the spice side. And so a lot of people make you know, spicy margaritas with that. Um, and so that one has more uplifting. We love lion's main. I love lion's main and ashwagon and healthy anine. Those are the three um adaptogens that are in both of them because those are good, like mood-boosting adaptogens. And then awake has um a Brazilian route and some other things to kind of help you focus and give you a little more energy.

SPEAKER_03:

So do you have to go to Brazil to find the root? Do you travel to find the ashwagonda? And I can't believe you're cooking that like you're making this one to two times or every other week, did you say?

SPEAKER_00:

You're making it so yeah, I would say on average we do a production run a week, uh once a week.

SPEAKER_03:

So that's amazing. Kitchen is always open at Droma. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Yes, it's always open.

SPEAKER_03:

I love that.

SPEAKER_00:

We just yeah, I be because like I said, I think you're getting a better product. I think with any of these like herbal products, um, and also because like people use these, uh, you know, it depends on how like some people use them within a couple days when they buy it, sometimes drink them fast and sometimes drink them slower. So like we want it to be potent, right? And we want it to be as fresh as possible. So depending on the consumer's usage and how they use it, um, they're gonna get the best experience out of it. But yeah, we're we're constantly producing um that's amazing. Producing work.

SPEAKER_03:

What uh what does droma mean? And how did you come up with the name?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, good question. Um, droma, so droma's Danish. It means dream in Danish. And I spent, I lived in Denmark for two years. Really? And uh yeah, I I just felt I fell in love with the people, the culture, the language, um, kind of everything about Scandinavian, all about Scandinavia. And so um, I wanted to incorporate something like so a little bit of like the design elements too on the bottle or Scandinavian. Um you know, we use a lot of illustrations uh instead of like we want to create more illustrations on the front of the bottle versus like words, right? And so like people can kind of see like, oh yeah, it's got maple, it's got some melon flavor.

SPEAKER_03:

So like you can kind of see it right on the label.

SPEAKER_00:

Yep, so you can kind of see it, see what you're getting. And then so some of the design elements were Scandinavian-based. Um and really like the way that we approach and the way that we the way that I see the non-alcoholic space is how I want is kind of like the way that the Danes and and Scandinavians kind of view food, beverage, and spending time together, right? Like, yeah, they're all about good quality food, they're all about good quality drinks, they're all about spending, you know, two to three hours together at dinner time, just sharing stories and drinking.

SPEAKER_03:

Isn't that something? I mean, think about how different that is than in America.

SPEAKER_00:

It really is.

SPEAKER_03:

I mean, it's so opposite, right? We're like, okay, everybody run, you know, even if you're not gonna be able to do that. Yeah, it's like you're eating.

SPEAKER_00:

And so I love that they do that there, where it's like, hey, let's just take a bat, like like, let's take a break from the day, let's enjoy our dinner together. And so I want that, like, for when I when people like think of drama and think of like the non-alcoholic space, like I want it to be, that's kind of what I want it to feel like. Like, yeah, you want to be able to sit down with your cocktail. Like the whole point of drinking a cocktail with your friends is to, you know, share stories and laugh and feel, you know, feel relaxed and just like be together. And like that's what's fun about cocktail culture, right? Like it's not fun drinking on your own, getting smashed, and then waking up with a hangover the next day, right? Like, that's not in there. That's not really that's not really the highlight of drinking. The highlight is like being together and being able to just be like loose and just like sharing stuff with so like I want that, like, that's what I think the non-alcoholic space should be too, right? We want that to be the we want, we want it to be that same feeling. And so anyway, so we want to like, so it's Danish culture. So we I don't know, we try to hint at that sometimes. I don't really like publish too much on like the Danish side of things and like the Scandinavian side of things of the brand, but hopefully it comes across um, you know, when when we talk to people and like how we share like drama. And so like this, and they also like sustainability is a big part in um in Scandinavia. And obviously, like we are reliant on plants for our product, and so we also donate 1% of our revenue to um an environmental group. It's called 1% for the planet, and that go goes towards like different um things, you know, everything from like saving the rainforest to more sustainable farming and stuff like that. So um all of those elements kind of like tie into the Danish culture and uh and and the things that rubbed off on me when I when I lived there for a couple of years.

SPEAKER_03:

And one thing you have on your website on the site, you say um enjoy nootropic drink, uh garnished with friends and really good music. And I always forget to garnish, but I never forget to collect friends. So I love that. I'm like, you know what? From now on, I'm just gonna say I garnish my drink drinks with friends. And that is so true. Like, that's what you want is just to like garnish your drinks with your friends, be together, you know, spend time together and just enjoy, enjoy a non-alcohol cocktail. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, for sure. Yeah, and the droma, and droma is kind of a fun word because everyone says it differently.

SPEAKER_03:

So like I was gonna say, I know I didn't say yeah, okay, so droma, that's how you say it.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, well d the Danish, the Danish were, I mean it's droma. Like it's really it's kind of like a hard, it's a hard word to say for for an American because like the way that they pronounce that O with a slash through it is really like it's kind of like deep in the throat, which we like we don't speak like that. And so um, so but like if you would kind of translate it into English is like droma.

SPEAKER_03:

Um and so like except when you say droma.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, I mean everyone calls it like drome, drome, drome, like dromae, like I've I've got you don't care as long as they're saying it, right?

SPEAKER_03:

We have because I live in Louisville, Kentucky, and people say it, Louisville, Louisville. So like there's actually there's there's a joke, there's like t-shirts that have like all the different ways that people say it. You can actually make you could do something like that, you know, like obviously. It's one basically one syllable, Louisville.

SPEAKER_00:

Is it really?

SPEAKER_03:

It's literally I didn't I didn't live here. I mean Louisville. It's one syllable, Louisville. That's crazy. Isn't that crazy? You would never know. But you know when somebody's not from here because they're like Louisville, you know?

SPEAKER_00:

But yeah, that's how I would that's how I say it. Right. It's how it's that's actually a really good idea. I should get a shirt made that has like all the different like pronunciation, like all the different ways people say it.

SPEAKER_03:

Uh-huh. Yeah, because and there's no wrong way, as long as you're saying it, right? As long as they're drinking it and they're ordering and reordering. It's so delicious. Actually, last year at the Mock Till Summit that I host, um, Derek Santiago of Mock Tel Wiz, this was his favorite, because I asked all the presenters like what their favorite non-alcoholic spirit is, and the uh the calm was his was his non-alcoholic spirit.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, he's made it, he's made a few drinks with our product, and we've you know done like some collaborations and stuff. So he's been a big supporter since day one, actually. Like I think I met him really early on. Um, like when I was kind of just getting on Instagram and reaching out to people, and he was always super supportive and loved the product. So um, which is cool.

SPEAKER_03:

He's listening. So Derek, we love you. We love you. Shout out to you. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Shout out to Derek. And I I would say in general, like what's been really interesting, um, again, I I came from a little bit different background. I wasn't, you know, an entrepreneur before this. Like I as a kid, and I've always wanted to like start my own businesses, but like one thing that's been really cool is like the community. And I feel like when I started, yeah, when I started like on Instagram, um, and again, I was I'm not even really an Instagram user before this either. I don't didn't really use it personally. And so like I was like, all right, I'm gonna jump into this and try to figure out what am I doing?

SPEAKER_03:

Figure out the stuff. You have your kids help you download the app. Like, how do I turn this thing on?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, exactly. And like every time I got a new follower, I was like, yes, this is actually working. And so but it was funny because I I think like you have like this really strong, sober and sober curious community where it was really easy for me to reach out to people on Instagram and just build, like, you know, slowly build relationships with people because even brand, like even other brands, suppliers, um, retail, like obviously, like the retailers are like a huge part of our business where the the non-alcoholic bottle shop retailers where like they are are always very supportive. And so like um, I feel like that really helped grow the business in the beginning was having all that support and all that like momentum from the space. And um, whether it was like at events or just talking to people, like, and then obviously like hearing stories of you know, of different people, like where they came from, their background, why they're not drinking now, like, you know, whatever it was that like triggered that change where that like changed that that all you know, that new lifestyle for them. Like I loved hearing all those, but there's so much that was that was really fun and like motivating, like versus, you know, starting up like you know, a chair business or something where it's like, all right, well, everything's cutthroat, everyone's at, you know, the lowest price wins. Like, I don't feel like I felt like with this industry, there's been a lot of there's a lot more depth to it and there's a lot more support and like people wanting to see everybody succeed. I mean, obviously as we get, you know, brands get bigger and there's like more corporations involved and things like that, like that changes a little bit.

SPEAKER_02:

Yep.

SPEAKER_00:

But I think what's cool, I mean, even if even if you look at the spirits industry, like there's so much room for small like manufacturers and small unique brands um within the space. And I think that will always be um possible within the non alcoholic space too, right? You're gonna have the big um you're gonna have the big brands and the seed lips and things like that. But there's so many, there's so many different ways you can go with your flavors and your branding and all those kind of things. And so for me, that's really cool where it's like, all right, well, we can just chug along, do our thing, focus on like who we are, tell our story, and um there'll be a place for us, you know? And so and I think that's that's been really fun to see. Um it's not as cutthroat as intense and there's a lot more support. And so I just want to thank you know any of your listeners that are that are out there too that are like have been supportive for our you know for our brand or for our you know as we've been growing and and trying to get the word out. So um I just appreciate all that all that support in the community.

SPEAKER_03:

The community's amazing it's been the the biggest surprise of um stopping drinking and then starting an Instagram account and everything is just the community and the support. Like I feel like it's this this like untouched space on the internet you know where like there's just community and support. There's I don't feel like there's everything everything else and it's really really nice. It really if only the rest of the world could follow along to how we're still doing it over here. So it's really I love it. I absolutely love it.

SPEAKER_00:

And it's still and it's grown too right so like when I first started I feel like it was a lot of sober sober like the sober community were very strong. And then there was like a portion that was the sober curious community that's like okay we we want to be part like we still drink a little bit but like we don't drink very much anymore. We're trying we're trending towards not drinking right and we're trying to find out ways to like do that. But I think now it's really cool because it's open like everyone is interested right like I agree agree. And so like big cocktail guy like people that drink cocktails and they're never going to stop drinking alcoholic cocktails are starting to get interested in droma and some of these products because it's like hey I'm gonna feel better if I only drink two cock two alcoholic cocktails in my evening and then I can have a droma cocktail and I can have like something like and so zebra stripe drinkers.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah yeah yeah actually I learned that from Derek zebra stripe drinker.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah it's somebody who like drinks a cocktail then we'll maybe we'll have a mocktail and they'll have a cocktail yeah yeah and so that like for for me that's exciting because that opens up the whole world right it's not like it's not a segment it's not like a portion and then obviously you've got anyone that's in cons you know health and well like anyone that's concerned about mental health and physical health and emotional health right like obviously alcohol plays a big role in a lot in those three areas and so you're right you know so you've got that that like space. And so it's cool to see how it's expanding where it's like not you're kind of moving out of this like smaller segment into like a little bit more sub-main type consumers. It's um and I think it's cool and and so it's cool to see that like I love seeing the community grow and get and having people more and more people interested to be to to just try the products right like that's yeah I think a lot of a lot of times our biggest thing so we do a lot of farmers markets and different things like that where it's like hey we'll come we'll we'll make drinks for people let people sample and I always am surprised where you know a lot of people are like hey I don't why would I drink like a non like non-what's the point like what's the point right like it's just gonna be sugary it's not gonna taste that good and so my like it's so fun to kind of see the expression on people's faces when I like give them a shot of drama or like make a little simple cocktail for them and they're like whoa okay like I can I can see this you know and then they and then they grab the bottle look at the ingredients they're and then they're sold right and so that is really fun to see the development of like um just people broadening their horizon out of that because I mean our biggest problem too is like going to a bar to go sell droma and they're like hey sorry we don't do any like non-alcoholic stuff we have you know we've got soda water or tonic and we make people like something like that. And I'm like, well do you know that like you know 25% of the people coming in here would drink a non-alcoholic cock you know and so it's like educating them around education especially of restaurants.

SPEAKER_03:

Yep it feels like that way.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah those establishments people actually want to drink these things right if they had good options and so that that I think it's just getting better and better. We're still obviously kind of in the early days and I think there's going to be so much more development and I'm excited to see like all the new products and new directions that people that people can go with this.

SPEAKER_03:

So it's fun so exciting so exciting um I was like do I want to ask you what's been what's been like the one hardest challenge that you were like didn't expect like this what is happening right now like has made you has anything made you want to quit has anything terrible really terrible happened that you were like I got to get out of here I'm going back to finance and work yeah uh there's bit I mean there's tons of like little challenges every day.

SPEAKER_00:

I mean think I had like there was one time where I thought I was like this is probably I'm not gonna make it or I don't even know if I want to do this. And that was like we did our very first production run. So we partnered with you know a distillery a craft um distillery down in San Diego. And I think it's always hard to go from like you've got like your idea you've got your samples you've got like um what you think it's gonna taste like in production right and then so like going from that like small batch you know like a gallon of your product to you know all of a sudden to like 200 gallons like I mean we didn't want to do we never wanted to do like a huge huge production run um just because like I said like that's something to us it's important to have like the fresh product but the first production run um was awake and it was a small production run but it was like big enough to like it was big enough whereas like scared you it's yeah it was a lot is a lot of bottles and so and it was like all right we did everything the way we need like the ingredients the recipe everything was just kind of like exactly how we had like tested it you know in our small in our kitchen and like we had like a little consultant helping us too and then you go into this you go into this big production run you're nervous and then like I remember the product just like not tasting what I expected. It wasn't the same no no oh no and I was like oh my gosh like what did we just do? Yeah and I was like we I mean we knew exactly what the recipe was we did everything yeah like we needed to do and um I just remember it's like oh gosh this is like not what I wanted and I had all these bottles you know I had a few hundred bottles and I was like I don't even know what to do with these bottles and so anyway so it was like I remember driving I remember driving away from you know the distillery that day and I was like man I think I just like made a mistake I can't do this like I'm not like I don't know how to like I'm not a I'm not a craft distiller distillery like how am I supposed to how am I supposed to fix this you know but so it was like it was like go back to the drawing board figure out what elements could have been like you know once they're in like large scale productions like how do things change and um you know I was scheduled to do a calm run the next day right and so I made some I'm not feeling very calm. Yeah exactly and so um we made some changes I mean some of it was like taking out some water making it a little bit stronger adding some other components so we made some of these adjustments to calm where it was like maybe if we would have done this to awake and so calm turned out great and I was like oh nice okay so like what are you basically I kind of gave away some of the other awake product and then I like did another production run and started like and things changed but it was like oh man like that was so I was pretty bummed at that point where I was like I spent all this time you know on branding and development and everything sourcing like when you're trying to like like everything like when it's from scratch it's like there's so much that goes into it and then you put it all together and then it doesn't it doesn't come out how you expect it. You're just like oh gosh like this is a nightmare. Should I throw in the towel here? But um but luckily like yeah luckily we fixed some of the problems and the way that we were producing it and so it was like all right now we got it under control. But that was a scary that was a scary time and like a point where I was like I don't know if I want to do this anymore. Yeah well what made you kept going so I already had the calm scheduled to be product produced the next day or like two days it was like two days away so I already had calm production run paid for like everything was already done like if it would have been like I did awake and then I didn't have anything else I didn't have calm to produce or anything or if both of them were really bad it probably would have been like a different story. Maybe I would have just been like I can't do this. But then luckily I just already had the the the calm scheduled for the next couple days and I went back to like my consultant and like the guy that I was working with to on the flavors and like we went back and we're like all right what could we do to make sure this doesn't happen to the calm run. And so we made those changes and those little those little things. So it was almost like I was into I was almost into deep where it was like I can't get out like I can't turn around now. I can't turn around I gotta turn around now. And I think that's that happens a lot in this in like when you're running a business where it's like all right well that like didn't work out but I've already got these other things that I'm working on and working towards so let's just keep pushing let's just keep pushing forward on the other stuff that we need to attack right or we need to like face like maybe that like you know and whether it's like advertising or marketing or a certain supplier that we wanted to use or you know like all these different things it's like all right well we kind of just we can't dwell on that let's just move forward and keep moving and trying to find out a solution as we move forward. And so I think that was kind of what happened with with this production run was like, all right, well, Wake didn't work can't dwell on it. Let's try to fix calm and let's just make this happen. And so I think that's kind of sometimes the attitude you need as a business owner or you're trying to do something that's like out of your comfort zone where it's like there's gonna be some issues there's gonna be some stuff that you're gonna face and like figuring out ways to get around it or just because you can go around things or you can go over them or if you can just plow through them right like there's different ways to approach these problems and like I think every problem that you face there's probably going to be a different solution for that. But you know I think what happens is if you get stuck and then you stop moving and and and you're not making decisions, right? And so like that's something that I've learned for sure over the last few years is like sometimes you just got to keep going. There's gonna be issues that come up and you just got to keep moving along. So luckily luckily I'm so glad you kept going.

SPEAKER_03:

I'm so glad that you already had Calm lined up it was already that first run was already paid for so you couldn't turn around couldn't back out I was locked in um all of us who are huge fans thank you for continuing to move forward and just make it around those hurdles and stuff it's not easy to be a business owner especially in a space that's that you're building you're just you're helping to build out this new space. So thank you really I really really appreciate it. So yeah you're welcome lots of love from uh the community of thriving alcohol free yes thank you guys so cheers to you david cheers to you and thank you for being here today a really good thanks for having me I appreciate it big time cheers to you for tuning in to the Thriving Alcohol Free Podcast. I hope you will take something from today's episode and make one small change that will help you to thrive and have fun in life without alcohol if you enjoyed this episode and you'd like to help support the podcast please share it with others post about it on social send up a flair or leave a rating and a review. I am cheering for you as you discover the world of non alcoholic drinks and as you journey towards authentic freedom. See you in the next episode